Well the Scotty Nguyen Poker main event in Tulsa, OK at the Cherokee casino just ended last week and T.J. Cloutier won around $240,000 for the 1st prize. I'm not sure if poker takes out the tips ahead of time in Tulsa, but I sure hope so. It was reported to me that T.J. only tipped $240! I have to believe that tips were already cut from the prize pool and that the $240 was only a little extra pocket change he added in. I can't imagine only a 1/10th% as a tip on almost a quarter of a million dollar win. At least I hope so! The last stiff on a tip I heard this bad was the winner of the $100,000 Stardust blackjack tournament years ago that didn't tip anything and when asked why, his reply was, "I have a wife and kids at home to support"! You have to wonder what his mind set was going to this event, MMmmm, my wife and kids are hungry, rent is due, so are all the utilities, what the hell I think I'll go out to Las Vegas and play the Stardust tournament and spend what money I have to try to win some more...LOL.
In poker the dealers usually receive 3%-6% of the pool, Cherokee's dealers received 3% of the total prize pool for over 40 tourneys, for TJ's win alone this came to $7200+ the $240 for a total of $7440, just how much do you think is fair?
JUST A QUICK IDEA ON TIPPING. WHY NOT ADD A TIP INTO THE ENTRY FEE FOR THE DEALERS TO SPLIT, IE 10%--15% WHEN YOU RECRUTE THEM. THIS WILL GIVE THEM A INCENTIVE TO HELP SELL YOUR SATILLITE TOURNEMENTS FROM THE PLAYERS AT THERE CASINO TABLES. THE MORE PLAYERS THE BIGGER THE TIP POOL, THAT WAY THEY WILL HELP SELL THE TOURNAMENTS. PS. I ENJOYED THE ON AT THE TROPICANA!!
I think this may be a good topic for discussion under "IDEAS FOR IMPROVING TOURNAMENTS" so I'm going to start a new thread using this quote. Thanks ANDREW BELL.
How much would you deal for is the question? Like I posted above, I wasn't sure if the casino took out for the dealers tips from the over all event(s) or not. I was just replying what was told to me from one of the casino staff. But when you look at over 50 tables in use for about minimum 8 hours on day one. Then lets say 30 tables on day two, 10 tables on day three and then 3 tables on day four, (all at 8 hours per day, and add in the relief dealers about half the regular dealers). I am guessing a total of about 140 dealers, 8 hours average per day would equal = Day 1 = 600 hours, Day 2 = 360 hours, Day 3 = 120 hours, Day 4 = 40 hours, all totaled = 1,120 hours divide $7,440.00 = $6.64 per hour for the dealers (plus their normal hourly fee). So to answer your question how much do I think is fair, I'd have to say 3% is fair, when you take in the fact it is 3% from everybody that got paid. Now on blackjack, I think it is a little different, less time dealing, but still you need to figure out what the breakdown per dealer would be to be fair while at the same time, not giving away all your winnings. And lets not forget, that in most tournaments, the dealers still split the tips with the rest of the dealers on the regular tables and I can promise you that they make more then $6.64 per hour on the average on the regular tables. Now all the figures I posted are just guess-a-mits on my part, but it gives you something to think about next time you go to tip out the dealers. I myself normally tip out $5 for each round I advance in (in bigger events, not the mini's), plus anything extra I may win in the finals. Hell I'd rather tip out my dealers and have them on my side and for only $5 is a deal. Hell most of us tip $1 - $5 for a waitress to bring us a drink or in my case a $1 for a bottle of water. Just think about this, you need a time change or just want to switch seats or tables, I promise you taking care of the tournament staff helps you on little things like this. The staff knows who takes care of them and who treats them right and by doing so works with you when and if you need anything. I think on bigger events $20,000 or higher the minimum tip should be 3% of your winnings is fair.
I dont know where you came up with your numbers but then again you are not a poker player. There were 124 players with a prize pool of $601,000, the dealers received $18,030 + any extra like TJ gave them for this tourney, !3 starting tables, 5 tables on day 2 and 1 final table on day 3. There should have been a total of 21 dealers dealing this tourney and the prize pool is divided by the total number of downs dealt (a down is a 30 minute session) and then the dealers get paid by the number of downs dealt. I heard the dealer rate for all the tourneys in the 2007 SCOTTY NGUYEN POKER CHALLENGE IV was $29.00 per down (30 minutes of work or $58 per hour + $5.15 for a total of $63.15 per hour), and I consider this a very fair wage.
Where are your numbers coming from? My numbers may be wrong, but where did you get your numbers from? Also I see you listed what you heard the dealers received over all, but for how many tables? How many dealers? How many days? How many hours did they deal during all the tournaments? How long were they having to be at the casino for training and instruction for the tournaments or having to hang around just in case? From the casino management, I was told the dealers were not taken care of the way they expected to be from the poker events.
The number of tables or number of dealers makes little difference as they are paid according to the number of downs that each dealer deals in the tourney. There is no special training for a poker dealer to deal a tourney, if they can deal a cash game they can deal a tourney. And there is very little hanging around because poker players differ from BJ tourney players since as soon as one exits a tourney, they either enter a second chance tourney, single table satellites or start to play cash games therefor the dealers are needed for these. If dealing tourneys were not profitable you would not dealers that travel around the country following the tourneys.
Are these dealers that all work for the same casino company, such as Harrah's perhap's? Dealer would have to be licenced by each state and hired by the host casino, so a wouldn't think there would be too many traveling tour dealers anyway. And like you posted earlier, Tulsa Cherokee only had 13 tables so I really doubt they brought in new dealers from out of town and cut their regular dealers out of dealing their main event. And finally I was contacted by Tulsa and the dealers did receive a percentage from the events, (which they should). The totals from my earlier post were lower then they received, but the amount's you posted were over double what they actually received.
If they split the tips, the number of tables or downs and dealers would have to make a difference on how much they made. Poker dealers do not split tips, they get paid from the tip pool by the number of downs that they deal. Are these dealers that all work for the same casino company, such as Harrah's perhap's? There are many poker dealers that work for themselves and travel around the tourney circuit. Dealer would have to be licenced by each state and hired by the host casino, so a wouldn't think there would be too many traveling tour dealers anyway. It only takes a couple of days to get a gaming badge and they apply before the tourney and they are hired as temporary for the event only. And like you posted earlier, Tulsa Cherokee only had 13 tables so I really doubt they brought in new dealers from out of town and cut their regular dealers out of dealing their main event. They did bring in out of town dealers but they came from their other properties, remember that there were about 40 tourneys in 20 days, not just the main event. And finally I was contacted by Tulsa and the dealers did receive a percentage from the events, (which they should). The totals from my earlier post were lower then they received, but the amount's you posted were over double what they actually received. Since I played and did not deal the numbers I stated were given to me by a dealer and were for all the events not just the main event.
The numbers I last stated were given to me by the management, actually the head number cruncher, so I'm pretty sure he'd know.
