What if?

Discussion in 'Ideas to Promote or Improve Tournaments' started by TXtourplayer, Nov 28, 2007.

  1. TXtourplayer

    TXtourplayer Executive Member

    What if there was a blackjack tournament where the total entry fees and re-buys (lets say $750,000) created a hugh overlay (very positive EV + $600,000), but the casino was able to get outside sponsorship and possibly TV money to more then make up the differance for the guaranteed prize pool, let say another $1,350,000. Wouldn't that be a positive EV?

    Would you play in such an event?

    If not why?

    My point is what differance does it make where the prize money come from as long as it is guaranteed and the events are held!
     
  2. toolman1

    toolman1 Active Member

    Problem with that is that it would attract all the big guns like the WSOB qualifiers did in Jan., 2007 at the Hilton. The entry fees would need to be high and combined with the big guns being there, few average/inexperienced players would play.

    Just my off hand thoughts.
     
  3. LeftNut

    LeftNut Top Member

    Gotta agree with Toolman on this one, the ploppy types would be unlikely to take a potshot at it for the entry fee level that would be necessary.

    For my own situation, I wouldn't be afraid of the "big guns" - respect is one thing, fear is quite another. For example, on the TV show, I had all the respect in the world for HD's skill but wasn't the tiniest bit afraid of him. However, my guess is that the entry fee for Rick's concept event would be middle 4- to low 5-figures, and there's no way in hell I could fade that right now without a backer.

    Sure is a good idea and I'd be rooting for this concept in a big way!!!
     
  4. TXtourplayer

    TXtourplayer Executive Member

    Actually lower then you may think...

    The entry fee I am looking at is only $600, with $300 re-buy and based on availability a second re-buy at only $150.

    I am also basing it on only 90 players per month. Although I would expect a little more for the first six months of qualifying and even more for the last six months of qualifying.

    If I was to get this event up and running, there would be satellites at willing casinos held around the country to win seats as well. Entry fees would be charged by the hosting casinos, so they could be lower weekly entry fees possibly.

    And FGK will like this, if I can make this event a reality, we will have not only sponsorship, but lots of advertising and marketing.
     
  5. toolman1

    toolman1 Active Member

    We (the forum) talked about what you are suggesting about a year or two go.

    This sounds like a makeover of the qualifiers held at Indian Casinos for the WSOB. The only way they were able to attract players was by offering really cheap entry in the "satellites" or "qualifiers" - whatever you want to call them. The Ho-Chunk in Wisconsin tried to charge $400, got less than 20 takers, and canceled the event. That in spite of the fact that a player would get his $400 back if he won the first round (2 advance).

    The only casinos that may consider this are independent, aka Indian, casinos. A larger casino will not hold satellites if the final event is not at their casino. Why give the competition all the glory?
     
  6. fgk42

    fgk42 New Member

    Whats the monthly guarentee for the $600 entry?

    The re-buy issue, while nice, shouldn't be stressed as much - just my opinion
     
  7. TXtourplayer

    TXtourplayer Executive Member

    If it were just about the money...

    If I can get a willing casino, I think $40,000 guaranteed per month is a good number to work with.

    I also would be willing to let the casinos pay in good promo chips for part of the prize pool if not all the prize pool.

    That is for the monthly prizes anyway!
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2007
  8. fgk42

    fgk42 New Member

    Lets see a 600 entry fee of 90 players for a 40,000 prize pool?

    Can anyone else besides me say FAILURE ALERT!

    Several point:

    For mass appeal the 499 is the critical mass - any higher than that and the number of players drops precipitously so if you want 90-100 player think 499 with the re-buy situation

    If you gotta go above 600 make it an even 1,000 and only expect 30-50 players but for 1,000 you BETTER have a prize pool of 70,000 and above.

    For example there is a 50,000 tourney taking place in January with a 100 entry fee and re-buys. I will bet anyone that there will be over 400 players with probably 200 rebuys and that the casino makes $ off that event.

    Stop it with this magical 1,000,000 event will ya?

    Think smaller to start. Look at the WSOB super-satellites and what they cost and the players it drew. If the WSOB had a 500,000 instead of 1,000,000 I BET 2/3 to 3/4 of those players, myself included, would have still taken a shot.

    You gotta know you market better and go one end or the other. But I can say this: 600 for 40,000K will NOT draw 90 players a month. PERIOD
     
  9. TXtourplayer

    TXtourplayer Executive Member

    Just using the old LVH as a measuring stick

    The old Las Vegas Hilton Million Dollar Tournament (orignal) drew in about an average of 115 - 120 players over the first six months. The last six the average went up to about 175 -180 per month and that was with the qualifiers already in not playing anymore in the monthly events.

    I think the number of players (average of 90 players) is a very fair amount, if we can get a willing casino to gaurantee the monthly and championship prize money.

    If the players were willing to fork out $1,000 each month with no re-buys, I'd have to think they would love the reduced entry of $600 plus chances to re-buy and avoid the additional travel expence of having to come back again and try for the higher orignal entry fee.

    However it doesn't matter if we draw out plans for a $1,000,000 event or a $50 to $100 entry fee event, unless we get a willing casino it isn't going to matter either way.

    I do want to point out that with a $50 to $100 entry fee event that the casinos are not going to market and promote the way they would for a $1,000,000 event. Nor would any outside sponsorship be willing to add money in to the cause.

    The million dollars range is where I started getting interest from the outside sponsorship and film crews. They are not the problem, it is finding a willing casino and we can get this event up and running, even with a $600 entry fee.
     

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