New Frontier tournament question, ken, others

A

aleph_0

Member
Hi All,

Does anyone know what the format of next month's New Frontier tournament is? How many rounds, how many at each table move on, etc. Has anyone every played in this tournament before? What time does it end? I have to catch the redeye back east at 10:30 or 11:30pm and I am assuming the tournament would be over way before then.
Any information would be greatly appreciated.

On an unrelated note, I just played in a small tournament and didn't advance in my round but was wondering if I made the right move. Here's the situation. Two players advance, $25 to $500 limits, four players remain on the last hand with the following bankrolls:

Spot 1: 2,525

Spot 2: 1.650 (me)

Spot 3: 1,000

Spot 4: 1,100

Unfortunately I have to bet first and here are the bets and each player's first two cards versus the dealer Ace

Spot 1: 25, Cards: I forget

Spot 2: 500, Cards: T,7

Spot 3: 500, Cards: 3,3

Spot 4: 500, Cards: 9,2

Again, I have to act first and my question is do I stand or double my hard 17. The players after me have split/double oppoutunities but I don't have a good double opportunity. I stood on my 17. Spot 3 split and drew a 10 on the first 3 (which would have busted me). He ended up busting both hands. Spot 4 doubled and drew a 8 for a total of 19. I'm still in pretty good shape, if the dealer busts or draws to anything other than a 17 or 18 I move on. Of course she draws to a 18. But again, was the proper tournament play to stand or double?

Thanks,

Aleph_0
 
The New Frontier tournament is one of the most fun tournaments in the country in my opinion. I've played a fair number of them, with my best finish being second place. The format is a bit of a marathon, with 5 rounds in all. However, there's a reason for that... Two players advance from each and every round to the finals.

On the first day, you can play quite a few re-entry rounds if needed, at $150 per re-entry, plus the $300 buy-in of course. I've had some pretty expensive experiences there, since I usually keep re-entering until I advance or run out of rounds trying. Once you advance (2 of 6 at each table), you're off for the rest of the day. Round two begins on the following morning. Tables in rounds 2 through 4 will have 5 or 6 players, with two advancing every time.

It's a six-deck game, dealt face up, with betting limits of $5 to $100 from a live money buy-in each round of $300. Betting is in increments of $1, or even $0.50 with the $2.50 chips on the table. I once advanced by $0.50, though it was actually an error on my part that made it so close. Another nice feature is the availability of surrender, just like at the Hilton events.

The tournament staff does a good job of handling the issue of time limits for player decisions. They'll give you a minute or so to decide, and if you haven't placed a bet, they put an hourglass-style egg timer in front of you. When the sand runs out, your time is up. It's effective, without being nerve-wracking to the player.

As for your flight timing, that's no problem at all. The finals usually wrap up at about 4 PM or so, leaving you plenty of time to make the red-eye back home. I originally wasn't planning to attend this event in February, or the Stardust event immediately prior, but I changed my mind last week. I'll be there, so introduce yourself if you see me.
 
Your Strategy Question...

Whoa! I was just about to post my answer to your tournament strategy question and say standing was better than doubling. But, at the last minute, I reconsidered. I think hitting is better than either! It's a little like a free hit, though it's certainly not altogether free.

Most of the value in standing comes from the dealer making a good hand, and wiping out the competition. You get that benefit even if you bust.

You can afford to lose your $500 bet as long as neither opponent wins, because you have enough unbet chips to beat their possible push. But, if you manage to win your single bet, you lock out even a double-down win for either. Doubling is bad because it gives up the low, unless you double for a lot less ($45 or less) which is a meaningless amount.

This is interesting enough, and confusing enough, that I really hope some others will chime in with opinions. Come on guys, whadya think?
 
Thanks, Ken

Hi Ken,

Thanks for the quick responses to my post. By the way, when is the Stardust tournament? I didn't see an adverstisement for it on their website. Is is invitation only?

Also, I didn't even think of it at the time, but I think hitting the 17 might have been the right move. Thanks again,

Aleph_0
 
The Stardust is Feb 9-11, with the actual play being on the 10th and 11th. It is an invitational, but I understand they're short on players right now, so this would probably be a good time to try to get on the list.

If you're interested, give them a call at 888-271-1777 and see what happens.
Entry fee is $375 I think, with a $600 buy-in per round. First place pays $75,000. Format historically has been 4 rounds, with 2 advancing in rounds 1 & 2, but only one advancing from round 3 to the finals. However, if they have a low turnout, the format could easily be different this time.
 
I think I would have done the same as you and just held on my 17. If you bust you increase both players behind you a greater chance of beating you. By standing, if you would have won you close out both players.

Lets look at what would happen if you would have busted by hitting a hard 17, then player #4 double downs on their 11 and gets a 6 for 17, by you busting they can now win because you made it a $1,500 swing. All you would have done is given them a better chance of beating you, But by standing you win regardless of what happens since you both have the same hand. Your best odds were to make them beat you and even then you had to get middled (like you did) to lose.

Contact Mike Musicaro at the Stardust if you want in, tell him Rick told you to call. I just sent him a list of 50 players yesterday. He will need to check your play at whatever casinos you are rated at. You can contact me at [email protected] if you have any questions.


aleph_0 said:
Hi All,

Does anyone know what the format of next month's New Frontier tournament is? How many rounds, how many at each table move on, etc. Has anyone every played in this tournament before? What time does it end? I have to catch the redeye back east at 10:30 or 11:30pm and I am assuming the tournament would be over way before then.
Any information would be greatly appreciated.

On an unrelated note, I just played in a small tournament and didn't advance in my round but was wondering if I made the right move. Here's the situation. Two players advance, $25 to $500 limits, four players remain on the last hand with the following bankrolls:

Spot 1: 2,525

Spot 2: 1.650 (me)

Spot 3: 1,000

Spot 4: 1,100

Unfortunately I have to bet first and here are the bets and each player's first two cards versus the dealer Ace

Spot 1: 25, Cards: I forget

Spot 2: 500, Cards: T,7

Spot 3: 500, Cards: 3,3

Spot 4: 500, Cards: 9,2

Again, I have to act first and my question is do I stand or double my hard 17. The players after me have split/double oppoutunities but I don't have a good double opportunity. I stood on my 17. Spot 3 split and drew a 10 on the first 3 (which would have busted me). He ended up busting both hands. Spot 4 doubled and drew a 8 for a total of 19. I'm still in pretty good shape, if the dealer busts or draws to anything other than a 17 or 18 I move on. Of course she draws to a 18. But again, was the proper tournament play to stand or double?

Thanks,

Aleph_0
Click to expand...
 
i would have stood too.you had both the high and the low.the other players needed a swing to beat you.the pair of 3's against the dealer 11 is a pretty poor hand,(he is going lucky to end up with a push 1 win 1 loss).to double down effectively you pretty much need a 2,3 or 4.a ace might be allright.when the eleven doubles down against the ace,an ace,2,3,4,5,or six is probably going to leave them in a bad position.seven isn't real hopefull either (on average you will need 19 to beat a dealer ace.by staying you keep the high and the low untill the other players are forced to make what would be a poor strategy move in regular circumstances.
 
I would have...

I'm sorry Aleph_O I was looking at what you bet and how I would have play your hand after your bet. But go back to the start of the last hand, before you bet $500.

With a $550 lead over the closest player to you and only a $500 maximum bet I would have only played $25 and made the other two players "HAVE" to double or split to catch me. If they do they do, but if you lose and they win a single bet you still come out ahead by $25.

Think about a football game, when the team leading has the ball they sit on it taking a knee. Why? they don't want to give the other team a chance at getting beat. Well why would you give the other players a chance at beating you.

I believe I would have only bet $25 and take my chances. If they get and hit either a double or split they do, it's bad luck and it happens to all of us. It is easier for you to lose and one of them win a single hand and beat you on a swing bet then the other way. Why give them that chance.
 
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